Ban evasion so you can continue your triad against another user for their completely innocuous post definitely justifies a permanent ban from that single community.
I agree with that other user, go touch grass. You can use that time to do a lot more for animal rights than arguing with random Lemmy users ever will.
I believe you’ve misunderstood the exchange, which is understandable as it’s not that clear. Op clarified in another comment that they were informing the mod that another user was ban evading.
Oh ok, thanks for pointing that out. I was confused too!
Tirade?
I feel like there was a bit of escalation on your end here
I did not name call or curse but the 2 commenters have.
But you did jump right into China comparisons. It’s not too far off from Godwin’s law.
Because it is a fair comparison to the situation.
It seems to me like it’s about as fair of a comparison as saying “having a dog when you only have an apartment is like slavery”.
If you would have commented on the unfortunate nature of our society pigeon holing people and their pets into these predicaments instead of being accusatory I don’t think it would have spiraled as much.
Everyone embarrasses themselves as best they can!
You’re spitting venom about a horse who seems to be really well taken care of. That is a huge barn, a sizeable paddock and he even has a nicer shirt than I do.
It’s a community for posting pictures. No one wants to deal with your blatant negativity, scathing sarcasm and extremist views.
Ban justified.
Extremist views for wanting horses to live in peace without being caged in and being uncomfortably ridden on against their will.
“The slavemaster is in the right while the abolitionist is the extremist” got it.
The extremism comes from how you interact with those around you when that view comes into play and the comparaisons you make. The view that pet ownership is immoral is clearly a fringe belief in any case. So yes, extremist views.
Yeah no you clearly started the flaming.
Is all pet ownership torture? Aren’t dogs technically just Stockholm syndromed into loving their owners?
Get off the internet for a while and go enjoy the weather.
You’re welcome back when you feel better.
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
OP I think you should relax. I get what you’re trying to do but you have to understand “Okay we’re going to ban you” as a very predictable result of the personal nature of how you’ve chosen to approach it, and repeatedly trying to send the same message to people who have indicated they want you to stop. YDI
Okay we’re going to ban you
This did not say that, read the modlogs again. The horse has also indicated they dont want to be chained up, ridden on and imprisoned.
The lemmyworld instance is allowing disagreement on posts, So folks are allowed to make such comments.
“Disagreement” is fine, as was your initial comment mostly. Once someone’s heard your message, and explained to you that they don’t want to hear more, that is their right to do, and you need to stop repeatedly trying to communicate further specifically to that person that same specific message. The fact that you feel they are violating some other type of right in some other context doesn’t change that.
It’s a very different thing, saying that your general opinion is that horses shouldn’t be kept as domestic animals. That I don’t think anyone would have an issue with. It’s totally different when you are telling one specific person that they are bad, and not stopping repeating the message when asked to, or even when banned. I don’t think there is really any well-moderated forum where that’s allowed.
It’s a very different thing, saying that your general opinion is that horses shouldn’t be kept as domestic animals
LW ToS section 8.1 Do No Harm
One of the core beliefs of modern medicine is the Hippocratic Oath, and is the logical basis of this section. All users should strive to “do no harm” concerning advice given to other users.
Any studies posted to this site regarding the health or wellbeing should IDEALLY be at minimum peer reviewed, reproducible scientific studies.
https://legal.lemmy.world/tos/
Had OP backed up their claim with a peer review study on how horse captivity is harmfulness to them, then LW admins would have had to remove this post to comply with their ToS.
Actually, they provide one below: https://beva.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.2746/0425164044848000
Hm, to me that only says that having weight on their back changes how the horse moves and “may” contribute to some types of injury. It doesn’t say there’s any indication that it is bad for the horse. Do you or they know of a study that says there is?
Sorry for taking a while to respond Blaze. Here are more sources on the back injuries horses receive from carrying humans.
Results: At walk and trot, there was a significant influence on back kinematics in the ‘saddle with weight’ situation, but not in the other conditions. Overall extension of the back increased, but the range of movement remained the same. Limb kinematics changed in the sense that forelimb retraction increased. At canter, both the ‘saddle with weight’ and ‘saddle only’ conditions had a significant extending effect on the back, but there was no effect on limb kinematics. Conclusions and potential relevance: Weight and a saddle induce an overall extension of the back. This may contribute to soft tissue injuries and the KSS. The data from this study may help in understanding the reaction of the equine back to the challenges imposed by man when using the animal for riding.
The objectives of this study were to measure forces and pressure profiles when riding with a conventional saddle compared to bareback riding. An electronic pressure mat was used to compare contact area, mean total force and pressure variables for one rider riding seven horses at sitting trot with a conventional saddle or bareback. The use of a saddle was associated with a larger contact area and higher mean total force compared with the bareback condition. Mass normalized mean total force for bareback riding was lower than expected based on the rider’s body mass, suggesting that shear forces exerted by the rider’s thighs were not being registered by the pressure mat. In spite of the lower total force, the bareback condition was associated with higher average pressure, higher maximal pressure and larger area with mean pressure >11 kPa. Focal pressure concentrations were present beneath the rider’s ischial tuberosities in the area of the horse’s epaxial muscles when riding bareback but not when using a saddle. It was concluded that bareback riding was associated with focal pressure concentrations that may increase the risk of pressure-induced injury to the horse’s epaxial musculature. The findings also emphasized that researchers should remain cognizant of shear forces, which may not be registered by the pressure mat, but may contribute to the effects of riding on the horse’s back.
Muscle and Ligament Strain
Damage to the soft tissues is the most common cause of back soreness in the horse. This mostly involves the group of muscles along the back. Usually, all or parts of these muscles are strained while the horse is being ridden. The principal sites of damage are located just in front of and behind the saddle area. Signs include alteration of the horse’s performance and acute back pain. Most of these injuries respond to rest and physiotherapy, although several weeks may be needed for full recovery ( see also Muscle Disorders in Horses).
Another fairly common site of soft-tissue damage is the ligament that runs down the middle of the back. Signs of damage to this ligament typically persist longer, and the chances of complete recovery are not as good as for the uncomplicated muscle strains.
Kissing Spine Syndrome
The spinous processes are the bony structures that protrude upwards from the body of vertebrae. You can feel their upper points in the midline of the back between the large back muscles. They do not normally touch each other; however, with kissing spines syndrome, 2 or more do. This may be partially due to the effects of bearing a rider. When this occurs beneath the saddle area, some horses develop back pain. The condition may also cause a local bone reaction, small bone cysts, and false joint formation. Diagnosis can be aided by injection of local anesthetic into the affected spaces between the spinous processes. Many cases respond to rest and physiotherapy, but persistent cases may require surgically removing one or more of the tops of the spinous processes to relieve the crowding of the spines.
…Have they indicated that? We’ve only been shown a picture of a horse. That’s not enough to make that very aggressive claim.
Did you miss the chain or the cells?
No, I saw them. My point stands. Is there any thing to indicate the horse is unhappy about the chains, cells or rider? From the post itself, we have to assume the horse is pretty chill about their circumstances. Why do you assume otherwise?
Conclusions and potential relevance: Weight and a saddle induce an overall extension of the back. This may contribute to soft tissue injuries and the KSS. The data from this study may help in understanding the reaction of the equine back to the challenges imposed by man when using the animal for riding. Source
The policy is not currently in place. But if it were, it does specifically say a small amount and respectfully.
If you went with
You can’t morally justify chaining up a sentient, breathing creature for your own amusement.
And left it at that, it would have fallen under that policy, if it were in effect. As it is, with heavy passive aggressiveness and sarcasm, well, you’re on your own.
Everyone knows the Lemmy.World admin is very anti-vegan. Have a goodnight.
I don’t think this is a Lemmy world issue. I think on many instances you would also see the same behavior. Somebody sharing something genuinely, innocently, and it’s being leveraged and twisted into a political moment. That discourages people from sharing.
innocently, and it’s being leveraged and twisted into a political moment.
How can you call this innocent when horseback riding harms the horse.
Innocent from the perspective of the person who is sharing. They intended no harm, they did not want to get involved in somebody else’s agenda.
You clearly view the photograph in a different context, and you see harm. That’s fine, but if you’re going to bring that context into other people’s communities, you have to realize moderators may not want every person to be held to your standards. Hence the banning
So, let’s get this straight, you went into a thread, harassed and insulted someone , and you think that’s okay?
Nah, not only did YDI, YTA. A giant, gaping, post gangbang A.
Talk about an ironic username. YDI for going into a thread and immediately being accusatory and hostile towards others. This sort of behaviour would be unwelcome in most communities regardless of being on .world or not. If you had phrased things in a different, less hostile way (perhaps “I do not feel comfortable seeing horses in captivity”) then you likely wouldn’t have faced serious backlash or moderator action.
Regardless of what your beliefs are and how strongly you feel about them, being a hostile jerk will get you booted pretty fast from almost any community and it’s best to refrain from doing so if you actually want anyone to listen.
Meh read the room. This is basically someone sharing a picture of their domesticated pet and you chose to inject an unsolicited position you knew would be controversial. That’s what we call being edgy, and it’s widely regarded as annoying.
I won’t talk about the [de]merits of what you’re defending.
YDI:
99.99% of Lemmy boils down to “communities where you can discuss deep issues, and soapbox to your heart’s content”. Then there are a few islands of fluff, where people share pics and make some casual, non-divisive conversation. LW/c/pics is clearly one of those islands; yet you’re trying to trigger a discussion there? “My right to soapbox precedes the right of everyone else to see fluff”.
Crazyblu is spot on: you were being passive aggressive. You could have voiced the exact same discourse (“I’m against animals being chained” or similar) in a more polite way; or, if you can’t be polite due to the topic, at least be upfront with the aggressiveness, or use a dry tone. Pass-aggro is the worse of both worlds.
The user is clearly disengaging without arguing (“I’m not having this conversation”), but you’re still insisting.
BPR:
Unless context dictates otherwise, an omitted subject gets interpreted as the first person, so your comment reads like “[I] made a new account [to] circumnavigate the block…”. As such, the mod interpreting this as you admitting ban evasion is totally justified.
When you find a user evading a ban, instead of interacting with them, you report the user to the admins.
Even then, IMO the mod should have checked if you were evading a ban, based on usernames or asking the admins for help. That’s why I’m calling this BPR instead of YDI.
“Ban evading fuck off back into your hole cretin” is not an acceptable reason. You don’t insult users in mod logs.
The user refusing to engage is the same as a slaveowner refusing to talk about the harms slavery causes.
I agree with last point at least.
The user refusing to engage is the same as a slaveowner refusing to talk about the harms slavery causes.
“My soapboxing is justified!”
If you see moral issues on what users post, report to the mods. And if the mods don’t deal satisfactorily with your complain, drop the comm, block it etc. Stop trying to convert a fluff community into yet another debate community.
That would apply even if we were talking about genuine slavery of human beings.
The world does not revolve around your belly, nor around the causes that you defend, no matter how important you believe that those causes are.
[EDIT, from your edit] I agree with last point at least.
Of course you do, right? It’s the only part that I acknowledge that the mod might have done something wrong.
They’re still 90% right. The ban itself was completely deserved.
If you see moral issues on what users post, report to the mods. And if the mods don’t deal satisfactorily with your complain, drop the comm, block it etc. Stop trying to convert a fluff community into yet another debate community.
Besides the moral issues, due to the change of LW ToS with that section
One of the core beliefs of modern medicine is the Hippocratic Oath, and is the logical basis of this section. All users should strive to “do no harm” concerning advice given to other users.
Any studies posted to this site regarding the health or wellbeing should IDEALLY be at minimum peer reviewed, reproducible scientific studies.
https://legal.lemmy.world/tos/
Had OP backed up their claim with a peer review study on how horse captivity is harmfulness to them, then LW admins would have had to remove this post to comply with their ToS.
Edit: looks like they did: https://beva.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.2746/0425164044848000
Yet you remain silent on the enslavement of plants? Lemons aren’t even natural. They’re an unholy crossbreed created by humans. We’ve been enslaving and bending nature to our will for generations to suit us. We artificially cultivate them in cramped farm rows. We even modify the very genetics of plants! How is that not slavery as well?
That is morally equivalent to whatabouting the “enslavement of chairs” or “enslavement of cars”. Only a sentient creature can be enslaved. But thanks for helping us fill in our carnism bingo cards. “Plants feel pain, tho!”
Plants feel pain and communicate with each other, yet you see them as the equivalent to inanimate objects? And you try to take the moral high ground here?
I’m obviously shitposting but c’mon. You don’t see the ridiculousness of calling someone equal to a slave owner for simply refusing to engage?
deleted by creator
Did you expect the screenshots you posted to make people want to side with you?
If you bothered to look into it at all, you’d know that poster takes care of horses who would otherwise be neglected by their owners. I’ve had a few conversations and they definitely care a lot about the horses’ well-being.
You do seem antagonistic in an unsolicited way dear. I understand the sentiment.
Once upon a time I worked security for some horse jumping shows and a rodeo. I’m certainly no expert. The events happened on the property of some very rich people and I spent a lot of time around the groomers and horses. I was rather surprised by them overall. It didn’t seem like many wanted to get out or were mistreated by captivity. Many were mischievous and looking for any excuse to be obnoxious. I had my two way radio pilfered on multiple occasions. There was an occasional escapee, but they never seemed to be actually trying to escape. There were times that it was obvious they knew where to go if they wanted to escape and they would threaten it like a cat that is not getting enough attention and decides to become a gravity fizicist, but it was always like someone looking for drama and proud to show off how they figured out the latch of their stall. They weren’t stressed but were very playful in all the circumstances I saw.
Perhaps it is my own imprisonment from physical disability here, but I never got the impression that the horses really didn’t like their lives. Perhaps it is due to so many generations of domestication, but they all seemed alright for the most part. The jumpers were fed lean before events and so they were about as moody as I was before I did a bicycle crit race back in the day. It is just something to think about that perhaps things are more complicated and your ideal picture of a horse in the wild is not as related to the reality of a domesticated horse. Many likely wouldn’t survive in the wild. This is a subject I very much struggle with on the human side. I struggle to be content within my limitations and dependence on others now. Without my familial support I cannot survive, and that support has a very real and upcoming limit that is likely to cause my very real premature demise.
It is not about right or wrong or sides for me here. I’m just sharing my one perspective that things can be more complicated dear.
Also, the women that come to jumpy events were beyond hot. Many showed up in the middle of the night, by themselves, and worked far harder than most men after driving hundreds to thousands of miles. Their relationships with the horses were remarkable too. From what I saw, it was very much a collaborative type of relationship. I’m not saying all are like that, but all that I was around were like that. One of those horse ladies can adopt me any time, and I pretty much live in a stall already. I would greatly appreciate someone feeding me and keeping me on my physical therapy routine. We all adapt to our own levels of normal, but so far I would still rather live than die even in my circumstances.
Lemmy.world is a trash instance and i would not mind seeing all their servers burned to ashes, but OP is also a pearl clutching turd for shitting on cute horse pics. Fuck you Sunshine
If only I had a penny for every time a vegan wades into a random conversation to tell everyone how they’re oppressing some animal.
